Internationalization
These episodes are about going abroad: when it makes sense, how to test a new market cheaply and why expansions fail. Marc-Alexander Christ (SumUp) launched in four countries at once in 2012, Vivien Wysocki and Larissa Schmid (Saint Sass) tested the USA with a budget of around 100 euros a day, and Damian Maib (Genuine) builds e-commerce for European brands in China from Shanghai.
The guests agree that a new market needs its own structures: Gero Decker (Signavio) had sign-ups from India, the USA and Brazil but paying customers only where he had salespeople, and according to Damian Maib nobody in China was waiting for a German brand. They disagree on timing. Marc-Alexander Christ advises going international from the start if the business needs volume; Sievert Weiss (Amboss) says get it right in one place first, then expand. Jenni Baum-Minkus (gitti) reports that expansion in Europe did not take off, and Alisa and Frederik Jahnke (Purelei) shut down France and Italy in 2022 despite several million in revenue.
The episodes are useful if you are weighing whether and when to enter a second country, or deciding right now whether to open the market with ads, salespeople or platforms.
Start with these episodes
Vivien Wysocki and Larissa Schmid mirrored their best German ads to the USA at around 100 euros a day and only then sorted out customs, taxes and warehousing.
Marc-Alexander Christ explains why SumUp launched in four countries at once, how a dedicated team opens new markets and why Russia was closed again.
Jenni Baum-Minkus tells why gitti's expansion in Europe did not take off and how she brought the brand back to its core.
Damian Maib explains how brands in China sell on platforms rather than websites, how to check demand in advance and why you need patience.
Alisa and Frederik Jahnke shut down France and Italy despite millions in revenue and today run their own store in Palma.
Gero Decker learned that Signavio only had paying customers where it had salespeople, and went to the USA himself through an accelerator.
What you take away from the episodes
- 1
Go international from the start if your business needs volume
With small fees per payment, SumUp needs a great many merchants, so according to Marc-Alexander Christ it went into several countries from the start. The hurdles are always the same: a central bank licence, connecting to local card systems and the team; a new country has six to twelve months to reach the unit economics of the others.
from: The future of fintech: why AI now makes cold calls & the road to the super app - 2
Test new markets with ads first, then with structures
For Europe and the USA, Saint Sass simply mirrored its best German ads on Meta, say Vivien Wysocki and Larissa Schmid, in the USA initially at around 100 euros a day. Only once it clearly worked did translation, taxes, customs, shipping and warehousing follow; it helped that the name, website and Instagram were in English from the start.
from: From Clubhouse to a multi-million brand - 3
Customers are where your salespeople are
Signavio's sign-ups came mainly from India, the USA and Brazil, says Gero Decker, but the paying customers almost only from Germany, because that was the only place with salespeople. The consequence was simple: pick a country and hire people there.
from: A billion-euro exit and business lessons - 4
Check demand before entering the market
In China, Genuine can see in tools how much brands and categories sell at which price points, says Damian Maib. A good signal are daigou, people who already bring a brand into China from abroad on their own; the more of them, the more likely there is natural demand.
from: TikTok Shop, China speed and lessons learned: the future of e-commerce - 5
Plan for a long haul in China
Nobody in China was waiting for a German brand just because it is made in Germany, says Damian Maib. The market is fiercely contested, especially in cosmetics, and for most brands 2 million euros in first-year revenue is more than satisfactory; many realistically land in the mid six figures.
from: TikTok Shop, China speed and lessons learned: the future of e-commerce - 6
Use what works as your blueprint
A 95 percent market share among 10,000 medical students was no billion-euro market, says Sievert Weiss, so the Amboss founders transferred the working principle by the book: to the whole degree, to doctors' working lives and to the USA, where the exam is also multiple choice. His advice: break through in one place first, then expand.
from: A German startup ranks first, ahead of ChatGPT and Claude - 7
Set goals that sound impossible at first
In 2006 Romann Rademacher and his co-founder set out to sell into all 204 FIFA member countries. Wibit now delivers to 101 countries, and Romann's point is: if you only aim for ten countries, you end up with ten.
from: Making 80 million people happy with water parks
Quotes from the episodes
„… wer darauf vorbereitet ist, sieht das Glück eher.““Whoever is prepared is more likely to see luck.”
„… Payment so ein geiles Geschäft ist, dass wenn du einmal Payment gemacht hast, du … nie wieder was anderes machst.““Payments is such a great business that once you've done payments, you never do anything else again.”
„Aber irgendwo hinzugehen und zu sagen, das was anscheinend mein Lebenspurpose ist, zu verbessern, ist Nagellack, war lange Zeit super, super schwierig.““But going somewhere and saying that what is apparently my life's purpose to improve is nail polish was really, really hard for a long time.”
„Also China ist basically the fitness center of the world für die Firmen.““China is basically the fitness center of the world for companies.”
All 15 episodes on internationalization
FAQ
When should a startup go international?
It depends on the model. Marc-Alexander Christ says SumUp needed volume because of small fees per payment and therefore went into several countries from the start. Sievert Weiss advises breaking through in one place first and then transferring the working principle to the next market, as Amboss did with the USA. Jenni Baum-Minkus reports that gitti's expansion in Europe, run alongside new categories, did not take off.
How do you test a new market without spending a lot?
Vivien Wysocki and Larissa Schmid mirrored Saint Sass's best German Meta ads to the USA, initially at around 100 euros a day, and only sorted out customs, taxes and warehousing after it worked. Damian Maib checks data on brands and price points in China beforehand and looks for daigou who already import a brand on their own. Moritz Fürste says the first HYROX event in Miami Beach in 2018, with around 290 participants, made it easier to explain the sport in a new market.
What do you need to know about entering China?
According to Damian Maib, China is purely a platform market: purchases through brands' own websites are close to zero, and you build shop, keyword bidding and performance marketing inside apps like Taobao, Tmall, JD or Douyin, anew on each platform. Nobody there was waiting for a German brand, marketing investment in the first years is considerable, and 2 million euros in first-year revenue is more than satisfactory for most brands.
Why do expansions abroad fail?
Gero Decker gives the simplest reason: Signavio had no salespeople outside Germany and therefore no paying customers there, even though sign-ups came from India, the USA and Brazil. Alisa and Frederik Jahnke shut down France and Italy in 2022 despite several million in revenue, and Marc-Alexander Christ names Russia as the only country SumUp ever closed again. Tim Stracke says only 12 to 13 percent of Chrono24's users now come from Germany, while the 24 in the name stands for price comparison at home but is loved in the USA and Asia.